Kafka & the Teenage Nudies

milkboys Articles, News 43 Comments

We live in a time in which some Western countries have to deal with major cases of legislative schizophrenia. They want to protect kids by teaching them that sex is something dirty and disgusting.

But on the other hand they seem to have a perverted passion for destroying the lives of the very same kids by adding pre-teens to public sex offender lists, charging 10-year-old girls with rape for playing doctor or telling a teenage boy that he’ll have to get his boner photographed by cops because he was sexting with his girlfriend.

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The newest fad in this kafkaesque nightmare is to treat the same person as a child and an adult at the same time. This requires some mental gymnastics you’d think no sane person would be capable of.

So here’s what’s happening: A teenager takes a selfie of themselves while they’re naked. In the eyes of the Unites States legal system this means they just sexually exploited a child–themselves. But due to the seriousness of this crime they will be tried as an adult by the courts

After a 16-year-old girl made a sexually explicit nude photo of herself for her boyfriend last fall, the Sheriff’s Office concluded that she committed two felony sex crimes against herself and arrested her.

The girl was listed on a warrant as both the adult perpetrator and the minor victim of two counts of sexual exploitation of minor – second-degree exploitation for making her photo and third-degree exploitation for having her photo in her possession.

A conviction could have put the girl in prison and would have required her to register as a sex offender for the rest of her life. [source]

If sexting is a good idea in general is a debate worth having but trying a minor as an adult is an outright ridiculous premise. But in a system that literally hands out the death penalty to minors and mentally ill people all common sense must have been gone over board a long time ago.

A North Carolina 17-year-old caught in a sexting scandal faces charges of sexually exploiting a minor that could land him in jail for up to 10 years, since the law considers him an adult. But one of the minors he supposedly exploited is himself­—which raises an obvious question: how can a teen be old enough to face adult felony charges, but not old enough to keep a nude picture of himself on his phone? [source]

Comments 43

  1. UNFORTUNATELY, as long as we have idiots that espouse their stupid religion and how “god” is supposed to “rule” in this country with Republicans and more than a handful of Democrats as well, we won’t progress beyond this crazy mentality.

    And this is similar: Our “war on drugs” is and has been a dismal FAILURE and we incarcerate way too many people of color for doing the same things that whites do but are “punished” very mildly, if at all.

  2. “They [our government in general] want to “protect” kids by teaching them that sex is something dirty and disgusting.”

    And also somehow flatly ignoring that boys and girls are most definitely sexual beings a lot younger [easily around 11 and even 10 years old] than what they wish to admit. Kids are by nature curious about their bodies as well as others — especially their friends (which “ironically” many of them meet in churches and some sort of religious studies). And we refuse to teach them any sexuality at those ages when it would most prudent to do so.

    1. What you’re not seeing is that this is not just people in “power” being “prudish”. Believing that was the big mistake of the boy- and young man-loving sexual liberationists of the 1970s and 1980s. What you’re seeing today is entirely the work of feminism, with some backup from the right wing, but mostly feminism. Of course feminism is the new Christianity.

      “Kids” are sexually curious, yes, and so are girls, but generally females value sexual purity while males do the opposite, because of huge differences between male and female sexuality. So long as there is feminism and sexual mores are based on women’s viewpoints on sex, this kind of stuff will keep happening.

  3. @Matteob

    “Beyond insane and the UK is going the same way.”

    Closest to the truth so far, but not quite there!

    Call me a cynic, but I find it impossible to believe that the majority of people in authority – real authority – are actually that stupid, or so far gone mentally that they could be classed as clinically insane.

    It seems much more plausible to me that all this apparent insanity is actually the oldest, most persistent and low, pervasive trait of human nature from time immemorial – the result of people with a little authority grabbing the chance at attaining actual power by any means at their disposal and, in this case, as it ever was, the fabrication of some device (the creation of a phantom enemy, the invention of gods an demons, whatever), and the persistent foisting of such inventions upon the more subservient (and often less intelligent or weaker minded) sheep that constitutes some 80% of the majority of the people has the effect of pulling them into line, some willingly because they, too, see some small chance to gain a little power, others because they don’t want to go against the flow, and still others simply because they really are simple bloody idiots – clinically speaking, of course!

    I’m quite sure all you bright sparks out there who are reading this will recognise the “politics of fear”.

    I can honestly say that, while my path has often crossed, paralleled or briefly matched that of the flock, I actually never have been a sheep! As an outsider looking in, my ability to see the reality of what’s actually going on has been both a blessing and a curse my whole life but I personally disagree in extremis with the notion that “ignorance is bliss”!

    1. As if your bigot apes were/are any better. The level of government corruption in Mexico is through the roof not to mention that more than half your country is effectively ‘ruled’ by your drug cartels.

      1. Penboy, this is a classic example of how your douche-bag (wanna be owner of the comment section) attitude stifles participation and, most importantly, fails to see the point in other people’s comments.

        1. @Rogers:

          No it isn’t. This thread is obviously about the (existing) American criminal justice system and he was ragging on it when he (in Mexico) has no business doing so when his government is really no better in any respect.

          And my comment doesn’t “stifle participation” if the comment is to correctly inform or present a reasonable opinion. On the contrary, I and others help to keep these threads “honest”. So, you can put THAT opinion of YOURS where the “sun don’t shine”. :-)

        2. You are not wrong and his bullying response endorses your opinion. He is a horses arse and not the best of them.

          Adults can stand up to his bluster and bullshit but I do worry that younger people are intimidated by him and so don’t contribute.

          I think his response to Rector borders on being racist, if it had been the amerikan flag adjoining it, the implied attack on the religious authorities would have made penisbreath swell with pride instead he had to make an abusive retort.

          Is he Trump in disguise ?

          As far as I know, Mexico does not mistreat it’s youth in the fashion being discussed nor do any of the civilised countries. Mexico has it’s problems mainly caused by amerika and it’s ” war on drugs”.

          ” he (in Mexico) has no business doing so when his government is really no better in any respect.”
          Since when does geographical location bar you from having an opinion ?

        3. @kinkynuts:

          First, we all know because you’ve admitted to being milkboys’ own personal troll — in your own words so now you can’t deny it without showing all of us you’re a LIAR.

          You don’t know the first thing about Mexico and talking about their GOVERNMENT is not in any sense “racist” — but you’re too stupid to understand that.

          Do you get paid to troll or be stupid? Because there’s no other reason for you to comment here and continue showing us your ignorant disrespect for America (I won’t even add myself, because that’s a given).

          Shakespeare summed up your kind rather nicely: ”Life, is a tale, told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.”

          1. Man, you are such a fucking ignoramus, you are too easy.

            fyi, I’ve been to Mexico twice, I absolutely love the Mayan culture, the scuba diving and the cute boys.
            The Mexican people are charming, friendly and helpful.

            I do not have an “ignorant disrespect for America”, I have an educated contempt for it.

            btw, I only admitted to trolling you and yet you still have to respond, like your military, disproportionately, all guns blazing and from far away !

            Finally, how dare you tell me there is no reason for me to comment, just who the motherfucking hell do you think you are ?

            You are a sad, pathetic lonely little bully with no sense of self-awareness, decorum, modesty or intellect.

  4. This problem extends to much more than just minors and sex crimes. Our media is a major contributor to the problem. An 18 year old male that is a victim of crime is typically referred to as a boy. A 16 year old that commits a crime is generally called a man. The age of minority and majority are no longer defined. There is a ton of gray involved depending on what your goal is.

    The US has become so hung up about the human body. If I go to a gym or pool with a public locker room and shower I will not use it. It is a setup for criminal charges if you happen to be in there with a minor. We think we teach our children to be proud of who they are, but ashamed if anyone sees their bodies. Parents don’t even know what their children look like with no clothes as it is seen as inappropriate.

    I loved living in Europe for the 5 years I was there. People were so much more open and unconstrained compared to us in a country that is supposed to be provide a land of freedoms. I stayed in a small hotel in Belguim for a while. The owner and his family lived in the suite across from my room. On a typical Saturday morning as I would be getting ready to go about his two young boys would come running through the floor and likely my room wearing nothing but a smile. They were young, maybe 6 or 7, but they showed no fear and no shame. they were playing. My neighbors in Wiesbaden would enjoy their garden where they had a pool. Mom was topless and the son and daughter were nude. I miss those freedoms.

  5. Wasn’t it Noah’s kids that saw him naked because he was drunk? IN HIS OWN GOD DAMN BED? People just don’t know what true sexuality is because of how distorted it has been by religious morons. Supposedly god created the human body. Shouldn’t that body be a matter of pride instead of shame. Let’s say that nudity was a norm. It would probably make people not want to to transform themselves into walking fat blubber.

  6. What many adults fear most is children openly expressing their sexuality and natural curiosity about sex. We’re in the midst of a period of hysteria over the issue and ridiculous and unworkable laws have gotten passed–probably causing more damage than they seek to “prevent.” Keeping children away from sex? You might as well get water to run uphill. Common sense won’t return to this issue until more people speak up.

  7. I know not all religious people think this way, but the religious and moral zealots who are running the show have crossed the line of pathological to the point of blind ignorance. And the saddest thing is they are so blindly following their ‘moral code’ that they fail to recognize the ignorance in their laws and positions. Hypocritical and wanting to enforce their ‘ways’ on the rest of the world, for what? To save us all? From what? Why should they give a shit whether I go to hell and burn forever? They destroyed the lives of these kids for no reason but to ‘teach the rest of us how sex is bad’. They are brain-dead fucking idiots, and if there is really a Hell I know where they’re going to spend their eternity. It’s exactly what they deserve.

    1. I actually think a lot of these misguided religious people WILL go to Heaven rather than the other place…. but I also think they’re going to get a very, very, VERY stern talking to when they get to the other side. On the other hand, another subset of them will instead be at the Great White Throne judgement saying, “But…. but… there must be some mistake, I’m a Christian! What am I doing HERE?!?” with the Lord telling them, “Depart from me, you worker of evil, I never knew you!”

  8. The problem is that adults in the United States are both sexophobic, ephebiphobic, and refuse to recognize that the minute you hit puberty you are a sexual being.

    1. But for women, they become sexual in a different way from men, and now we have women in control of sexual mores. It means nothing to women that they might have become “sexual” when they were in puberty. Yet most women have no clue about male sexuality. Women value purity because they have no need for sexual release, and men disvalue not having sex because their bodies require sexual release.

      1. @Wordworth:
        “Women value purity because they have no need for sexual release, …”

        Just out of curiosity, I Googled: “female need for sexual release” and received 1000s of hits.

        But I looked through around 15 or so and found this as a recurring theme:

        It’s not, of course, as if feminism, or Internet porn, or any other feature of modernity has suddenly created desires that never previously existed. Rather, as Bergner and his researchers show, science is finally asking the right questions about what women want, perhaps because enough of us are ready to hear the answer. The broad and enthusiastic coverage of What Do Women Want—Amanda Hess at Slate and Ann Friedman at The Cut are nearly as swept away as Clark-Flory—suggests a collective cry of relief: At last, irrefutable evidence that women are so much more like men, and so much more full of erotic potential, than we had ever admitted.

        Yet acknowledging that women are as horny as men (if not hornier) isn’t enough to guarantee equality, just as the recognition that women are increasingly adept at breadwinning doesn’t ensure pay equity. Even as we see more and more evidence that women want what men want, antiquated sexual scripts mean that women are caught, as Friedman puts it, in a “catch-22” with “few options.” But is that dilemma one for which both sexes are equally responsible?

        Some say yes.

        .

        So, as many of us had said before, your “feminism controls America” ideas are pretty much bullshit.

        1. “Women are hornier than men”… based on absolutely nothing (citing Amanda Hess is supposed to result in a scientific finding??). You need to do more than a little Googling. The CEO of Ashley Madison declared himself “the most feminist person the world has seen” in 2014. Yet his company made bots (fake women) to troll men, to make it seem women wanted what men wanted. It was as fake as the “women want what men want” mantra.

          1. “You need to do more than a little Googling. ”

            You posted nothing but your opinion ….. women can be just as “horny” as any man.

            You’re carrying this “feminism” banter way too far and “out there.”

          2. I know the research in this area well, even if I didn’t post it. I have posted some of it before, though. But I thought I would bring in the Ashley Madison debacle as the most “current” evidence against your point of view (and that wasn’t opinion).

  9. At the end of the day though we do have “Freedom” which no one else can say they have.

    1. @flame2542

      The following article was published on a website in March 2009, which website (whose sole purpose was to inform the general public about the truth of the way certain clearly-identified unscrupulous organisations in the UK operated – then and now) was subsequently forcibly shut down because it dared to speak the truth and the UK’s totally one-sided legislation on defamation was used to forcibly impose that shut down, and the Editor/owner could not afford the huge sums of money it would take to defend against it!

      “EDITORIAL
      MARCH 2009

      AM I FREE?

      A simple question, to which there is no simple answer!

      This Editor would suggest the reality is there is no such thing as true freedom, only relative freedom, since we are all, at any given time, limited by our environment, the circumstances in which we find ourselves and, most important of all, we are limited by ourselves!

      To deny any of this, it seems, is to deny reality, but I really don’t want to get into existentialism or metaphysics – everyday life is difficult enough to understand and deal with effectively!

      It might be said that we all have freedom of choice. I would agree that is so, but only as long as it is recognised that restricted choice is limited, not free, and no viable alternatives means no choice at all!

      When dealing with organisations such as those highlighted in this website, there emerges an obvious pattern of utter contempt for the law, or for anything that any right–thinking person would see as reasonable or right and proper behaviour.

      Running alongside that obvious pattern is one which is less obvious, thus much more dangerous – apathy, or indifference!

      I find it hard to believe that the majority of people are entirely unaware of, or unaffected by, the abuses and criminality of these, and – no doubt – many other, organisations. This website, just like consumer programs on the television, e.g. Watchdog or Rogue Traders, can only highlight what is the tip of the iceberg.

      In other words, these abuses and criminal actions are happening all over the country, every day of the week, and every week of every year – by individuals, by commercial companies large and small, and by Government organisations, both local and national!

      Ignorance and apathy, or indifference, are the only things which allow these personal and social evils to persist!

      “All that is necessary for evil to succeed is that good men do nothing.” [Edmund Burke]

      and,

      “The price of apathy towards public affairs is to be ruled by evil men.” [Plato]

      When a person remains silent and does nothing about these wrongs, they are actually giving these criminals license to continue!

      “He who does not punish evil, commands it to be done.” [Leonardo da Vinci]

      It is human nature to wish to conform, to follow the flock, but this is simply a reaction to fear of ridicule and/or isolation.

      I say to live in such fear is to deny your self and to damage the essential you! What does it matter if others disagree with you when you KNOW, with every fibre of your being, that you are right?! Even more so if you can SHOW them you are right?!

      When people, either as individuals or en masse, are being harmed, deceived or abused in any way, do we not ALL have an obligation, a duty, to object to it and try to put it right? After all, if we let it happen to one person, we give permission for it to be done to ourselves!

      “Responsibility does not only lie with the leaders of our countries or with those who have been appointed or elected to do a particular job. It lies with each of us individually.” [the Dalai Lama]

      As this website has shown, it is not only individuals and commercial, profit–seeking organisations who perpetrate these abuses and crimes, but Government – both local and national – also.

      “The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only object of good government.” [Thomas Jefferson]

      When the Government creates laws which advantage commercial organisations over the people of the nation they are supposed to serve, or which simply disadvantage those people, individually or en masse, or when they apply the law in similar fashion, that Government is doubly guilty because not only are they supporting the abuse and criminal acts, but they are also in breach of trust and duty!

      In such circumstances, either the relevant law, or the way it is applied, or both, MUST be challenged and, if necessary in the interests of justice, it MUST be discarded or disobeyed by everyone, but – most especially – by those involved in its enforcement!

      “If… the machine of government… is of such a nature that it requires you to be the agent of injustice to another, then, I say, break the law.” [Henry David Thoreau]

      The majority of these individuals and organisations, both commercial and Governmental, might claim in any given incident ‘We made a mistake’, or ‘We got it wrong’.

      To err is human; we are all imperfect, we all make mistakes, in our actions and in our judgement.

      However, to continually repeat the same ‘mistake’ time after time after time, and to do nothing about it, exposes the LIE of such claims: it is not ‘error’, it is CALCULATED AND DELIBERATE, and therein lies the abuse and the crime!

      “Mistakes are a fact of life. It is the response to error that counts.”
      [Nikki Giovanni]

      And so we come full circle, back to the opening questions about freedom of choice.

      If you choose to swallow these, or similar, lies put out by these abusive and criminal individuals and organisations; if you choose to ‘suck it up’; if you choose to ‘let it slide’, that is your right, but consider this:

      If you think you have no power to change the way things are, think again!

      “You just need to be a flea against injustice. Enough committed fleas biting strategically can make even the biggest dog uncomfortable and transform even the biggest nation.” [Marian Wright Edelman]

      By choosing to say and do nothing about these abuses and crimes you are actively encouraging the abusers and criminals to continue, even to escalate, their abuses and crimes against your neighbours, against your friends, against your loved ones and against you!

      Can you – WILL you – just ‘let it slide’?”

      The Editor

      I think you’ll find your concept of what constitutes ‘freedom’ is covered here, and I truly hope it makes you re-evaluate that concept!

  10. @Alan:
    “… and refuse to recognize that the minute you hit puberty you are a sexual being.”

    Every human [“child”] is a sexual being years before the start of physical puberty — it’s a huge part of what being ‘human’ is.

    1. @Penboy

      “Every human [“child”] is a sexual being years before the start of physical puberty”

      NEVER a truer word!

  11. I think we (USA) are on a (glacierly-) slow path to correct some of these inequities. We’re finally recognizing that these “minimum guidelines” for sentencing real criminals are just absurd and (again, way too slow) are changing some of these laws — States and hopefully, Federal as well.

    A huge part of this is to finally recognize that the psychology of these laws and how some people interpret lives “as it should be” can be and are totally different and should not be used to incarcerate everyone on such ridiculous notions. We are finally, in today’s societies (US, primarily) rejecting the obvious outdated notions born by religions fanatics.

    Case in point: Because of America’s recognition that gays aren’t the “monsters” once thought (because of religion), we changed enough to remove being homosexuality (and its sex) from any criminal list and finally have approved same-sex marriage — accepted by the majority of American society now. When a religious nut-case tries to impose their morality even through a government agency (County Clerk), even a bible-belt State judiciary knows enough to put his religion on the “back seat” and rule in favor of civil rights (which is exactly what “gay rights” are) and put this religious clerk in jail until she can finally see the error of her morality (hopefully, anyway).

    Since we have [basically] finally removed homosexuality from criminality, I suspect within time (how much, I have no idea as yet) we will recognize the rights of children in a more complete way including that they can be educated sexual beings.

    1. The US Supreme Court declaring gay marriages a legally protected right across the whole country has been a major societal milestone. The last time something of this sort and magnitude happened was in the late 1960s when the US Supreme Court declared interracial marriages a protected right across the whole country, and I’m guessing it probably caused just as much of a freak out by the religious as this gay marriages thing did, but I was probably 3 years old or so when the brown stuff hit the fan over that one, so I have no recollection of it firsthand, and haven’t found any historical retrospectives on it to go by either to learn, say, how long it was before things settled down again after that.

      I HOPE we don’t have to wait that sort of interval AGAIN before the change in laws about teens and sexuality reaches the Supreme Court and the ones that penalize teens for their hormones get photon torpedoed. :/

  12. Admittedly it would be tough to figure out the causes of a social phenomenon while it is occurring around you in real-time. But, this is part of a process that began in the 1970s, and some of you guys are asleep with your heads in the sand and you don’t know where the gunfire is coming from.

    We have had plenty of time now to identify the problem. Religion is only related in a roundabout way. Primarily what caused this is feminism, but really it was also simply the entry of lots of women into the workforce, and from that everything else cascaded via women’s feelings about being equivalent to men, a lack of understanding that male sexuality is a very different thing from female sexuality, and men’s existential desire to sacrifice themselves for women (since we’ve been doing that for tens of thousands of years).

    1. Its taken a while to get there, but Wordworth has just put his finger on it. Hold that thought and work it up, widen the analysis; and you’ll find it is right on the mark.

  13. Just as speed limits on curves are set to accommodate the vehicles least able to negotiate them, many laws are written to care for or protect the least powerful members of society. Regarding sex laws, that means minors. Naturally, this good intention has thoroughly paved the road to Hell with unintended consequences, often exacerbated by well-meaning and self-righteous douchebags, unfortunately highly placed in the criminal justice system.

    Some kids, even teenagers, are late bloomers and/or slow learners, and indeed, they need the protection of law lest they become unwittingly manipulated, and wrongly taken advantage of. The arrival of maturity is a purely individual event. Some kids are ready for emancipation at 15, others are still kids at 21. Most Democrats, for example, never grow up, fantasizing of life in a Utopian dream world their entire lives. The commencement of sexual activity is sometimes the result of precocious maturity, but often amid circumstances of depressing immaturity, sometimes with catastrophic consequences involving diseases, drug abuse, pregnancy and no end of psychological issues. Hence, the laws we have.

    We had a case here in Tucson a few moths ago where a 16 year old boy was discovered to be thoroughly enjoying repeated molestations by TWO of his female teachers – they engaged in multiple 3-somes together where, we are sure, a lot more than his grades were inflated. When the story broke, the blue noses proclaimed the boy a victim and screamed for the teachers’ heads. A local radio news-talk station host said, “he’s not a victim, he’s a LEGEND!”

    Our sex laws need a thorough reformation. The weak, the stupid, the insecure, the undecided, and the anxious do need protection and more time to grow into the adult world, but a whole lot of kids, probably most, by the onset of adolescence, are sure of their intentions and only need a reason or a place to get it on. The law should protect their privacy and provide for the recognition of sexual maturity when and where it exists. We have a progressive right of passage as it is – driving is begun in mid teens, voting and general adulthood at 18, drinking at 21, running for President at 35 – it’s time to fit sexuality into that progression, so consensual sexting isn’t child pornography, and a charge of statutory rape requires a true finding of mental incapacity or ignorance to negate consent.

    1. You’re not getting it, Mr. Horselips. I’m sorry but people don’t give two sh*ts about any of what you’ve said. Males understand that it’s high-fives for the boy who has sex with his hottest female teachers. But males’ voices don’t count for anything today, especially in the realm of sex.

      Women don’t feel the way men do about such encounters, especially about “consent”. They take the term “consent” to have a lot of baggage, imbued with women’s general schizophrenia about what they want out of relationships with men. Until women sort out their strange issues with living in a modern society, until they acknowledge their evolutionary leanings, until they understand that there was no such thing as “patriarchy”, until they understand that males have more problems today than females, male sexuality will be taken hostage. It’s too easy to incriminate all men for liking the young, and harping on it brings much power to women.

      1. I can appreciate your fixation on feminism as the foundation of society’s awkward sexual dysfunction, but sometimes as Dr. Freud would say, a law is just a law. I do believe that the laws regulating (infringing, oppressing, perverting) teenage sexual conduct, and the pornography industry, most of which were written four decades ago, predate the hyper-ventilating, radicalized feminism/political correctness we suffer and endure today. Back then, bra-burning feminism was considered by most an amusing sideshow of liberalism, when liberal was still a bad word.

        1. Laws don’t mean everything. It takes public opinion to give them force. Lots of adults were having sex with minors in the 1970s and early 1980s.

  14. I know much of what drives this ‘Puritan’ mentality when it comes to sexuality is deeply rooted in strong religious beliefs.

    My great-grandmother was 11 years old when she got married. I do not know how old my great-grandfather was at the time, but I suspect only a few years older. Fast forward a hundred years and in this day and age even teenage children having consensual sex is illegal?? what that fuck is going on?? how did we let it get to this point??

    1. Its always the mothers–rarely the fathers–who seek to preserve their son’s virginity (for themselves, I suspect). It got to this point because professionals who work with children, teachers, coaches, social workers, psychiatrists, have been intimidated and bludgeoned into silence. Exception: Harmful To Minors, by Judith Levine, published in 2002. Dr Joycelyn Elders wrote the Foreword. Elders, Surgeon General of the United States, was hounded from office because of her honest and realistic views on sex.

      1. cf…
        “In 1994, when the Surgeon General of the United States, Dr. Joycelyn Elders, mentioned as an aside that it should be mentioned in school curricula that masturbation was safe and healthy, she was forced to resign, with opponents asserting that she was promoting the teaching of how to masturbate.”
        from Wikipedia

    2. See my post above about how it got to this point. It doesn’t have much to do with religion at all, at least not directly. It has everything to do with gender wars: women against men.

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